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welcome aboard !!!   i talked to josh at sun and fun and got literature from uavionix dealer at the airshow and gave it to him. josh will be going soon to the czech aircraft factory  to talk them and will try to get a L O A for uavianix adbs in and out  installation. get both for 2499 dollars. left and right wingtip  lights are replaced in ten minutes. easiest adbs solution hopefully get this done soon.  you can message him here or at josh.scheid@cruiseraircraft.com and he will be happy to answer any questions about this and his up coming trip. 

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2 hours ago, RussellJ said:

Hey guys, I'm new here, just became a member today. I wonder if I've missed something on this subject... Couldn't CSA simply issue a service letter/bulletin that says something like 'may install uAvionix skyBeacon ADS-B transponder...' and it would apply the entire fleet? Seems like it would work just as well as LOAs.

Hi Russell and welcome. Reading your post made me laugh and realize that you are the "new" guy here. :D There's a lot to read on this subject and the short answer is "no".

CSA has already approved the Garmin GTX-335 for ABS-B out to satisfy the 2020 mandate. This alone took them several years to do as they simply dont like "change". Thankfully the FAA mandate forced them to address the subject for US owners or they never would have. It's HIGHLY unlikely they will approve anything else for ADS-B OUT.

As mikeomaha stated he's also looking at the uAvionix equipment but the only way that would EVER be considered is for an owner to apply for it through CSA's brand new LOA process. To date, I know of no one who has started or gone through the process. CSA, after 13 years in business, just finally, within the last few months, came up with a LOA process. Mind you it's the most difficult and most expensive LOA process in the industry for current owners from my research. I dont know if mikeomaha is going to apply for an LOA for the uAvionix products so we'll have to wait and see if he does. Just dont expect CSA to issue a SB for any other product for ADS-B out. 

The "10 minute install" also does not apply to the SportCruisers as you'll need to remove the old Kuntzleman strobes and driver box behind the passenger seat. The newer planes have different light all together. On top of that you'll need to install some sort of adaptor plate that will allow you to mount the uAvionix parts to the existing threaded holes in the wingtip of the SportCruiser. Add to that some rewiring before you can install the uAvionix wing tip products. Take it from me, it's not a 10 minute install. 

I swapped out my old Kuntzleman NAV/Strobes with new Aveo Engineering Powerburts all LED NAV/Strobes and had to make adaptor plates so I count mount the new lights. They do not simply bolt on the wing. Then some rewiring. Just swapping out my old school, Kuntzleman xenon strobes for the cool Aveo Engineering ones took several hours to do.

Long story short, without paying a lot of money to CSA for time and research and for them to even consider this option could be a long shot. I give anyone props for attempting this new LOA process.

Hope this clears up a few things and muddies the water some more on other items. :D

Again, welcome to the forum.

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39 minutes ago, mikeomaha said:

welcome aboard !!!   i talked to josh at sun and fun and got literature from uavionix dealer at the airshow and gave it to him. josh will be going soon to the czech aircraft factory  to talk them and will try to get a L O A for uavianix adbs in and out  installation. get both for 2499 dollars. left and right wingtip  lights are replaced in ten minutes. easiest adbs solution hopefully get this done soon.  you can message him here or at josh.scheid@cruiseraircraft.com and he will be happy to answer any questions about this and his up coming trip. 

Hi Mike, I applaud your optimism on this actually happening. :D I know we talked about this at SNF and you like their products. It seems like a simple solution but the install is another issue in my opinion. Have you submitted the LOA form to Josh yet for the uAvionix products? Please keep us informed as to the LOA costs and time involved. 

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i will wait for josh to get back from his trip and get details about installation and process from him at that time. i will be in oshkosh this july and see him  and get latest information also.

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ShawnM, I guess I was under the impression that as long as an item, say... a starter battery, met the  ASTM standard the it could be used on a light sport. It seems I have lots to learn. Glad I joined the group!

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5 hours ago, mikeomaha said:

i will wait for josh to get back from his trip and get details about installation and process from him at that time. i will be in oshkosh this july and see him  and get latest information also.

I understand you are hoping to get this equipment approved and installed. Please keep in mind you are talking about waiting until July to "get the latest information" because the ADS-B deadline is fast approaching. If this is the equipment you are wanting I'd start the LOA process today by filling out the form and get the ball rolling. What if CSA just drags their feet as usual? With with the end of the year approaching you run the risk of being grounded or unable to fly in rule airspace. I wish you luck with this. 

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34 minutes ago, RussellJ said:

ShawnM, I guess I was under the impression that as long as an item, say... a starter battery, met the  ASTM standard the it could be used on a light sport. It seems I have lots to learn. Glad I joined the group!

Unfortunately it's just not that simple with S-LSA aircraft. ASTM International just produces the guidelines for LSA manufacturers to follow. It's the manufacturer who gets to say which battery to use. Do people install batteries that are not approved by the manufacturer? All the time. Is it technically legal to do so? Nope. In the event of an incident or accident, can your insurance company deny your claim because you altered the plane without approval from said manufacturer? Yup. Is this an extreme example? Of course but it can happen.

Glad you joined also, this site (and others) is full of information for anyone who is willing to sit back and read. So pour yourself your favorite beverage and click away. :D 

 

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10 hours ago, ShawnM said:

I understand you are hoping to get this equipment approved and installed. Please keep in mind you are talking about waiting until July to "get the latest information" because the ADS-B deadline is fast approaching. If this is the equipment you are wanting I'd start the LOA process today by filling out the form and get the ball rolling. What if CSA just drags their feet as usual? With with the end of the year approaching you run the risk of being grounded or unable to fly in rule airspace. I wish you luck with this. 

i can fly here in midwest without entering class C airspace easily. i have a zayon traffic alert installed that shows other transponder equipped aircraft with voice alerts on my garmin 510 and have altitude reporting transponder and can my plane be detected by other traffic devices on other aircraft. adbs out is a low priority for me now but to install adbs in and out easily and cheaply  is something i may consider. handheld devices can get you weather.  easy to talk me out of installing adbs out .....lol

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2 hours ago, mikeomaha said:

i can fly here in midwest without entering class C airspace easily. i have a zayon traffic alert installed that shows other transponder equipped aircraft with voice alerts on my garmin 510 and have altitude reporting transponder and can my plane be detected by other traffic devices on other aircraft. adbs out is a low priority for me now but to install adbs in and out easily and cheaply  is something i may consider. handheld devices can get you weather.  easy to talk me out of installing adbs out .....lol

I would never talk you out of ADS-B out, having it opens the floodgates for all traffic and weather data displayed in the cockpit. I love it. :D

Also, dont forget mode c veils. I dont remember if you are in or close to one but that's another part of "rule" airspace that you need ADS-B OUT. I certainly understand why the uAvionix products are desirable with their ease of install. It's not quite 10 minutes on a SportCruiser but still pretty easy. Having both their skyBeacon (ADS-B OUT) and their skySensor (ADS-B IN) on each wingtip is a nice setup and it's affordable with the rebate.

Good luck with getting this approved, there may be others who may want this also.

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i visited the local approach center here in omaha about class  C airspace and told them  i was concerned about density of air traffic without adbs out equipment  flying on the fringes of class C without radio contact. i was told that radio communication was not required as long as you remained clear and it was voluntary to contact approach control. FAA  at sun and fun confirmed this as well. personally i will make contact with ATC even if i dont fly in class C airspace and it is not required for me do so if i am within 20 miles of class C airspace for traffic advisories.  josh wanted to get technical information and diagrams  for installation from uavionix to show czech aircraft factory to expedite process and maybe get a service bulletin issued for installation.

 

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1 hour ago, mikeomaha said:

i visited the local approach center here in omaha about class  C airspace and told them  i was concerned about density of air traffic without adbs out equipment  flying on the fringes of class C without radio contact. i was told that radio communication was not required as long as you remained clear and it was voluntary to contact approach control. FAA  at sun and fun confirmed this as well. personally i will make contact with ATC even if i dont fly in class C airspace and it is not required for me do so if i am within 20 miles of class C airspace for traffic advisories.  josh wanted to get technical information and diagrams  for installation from uavionix to show czech aircraft factory to expedite process and maybe get a service bulletin issued for installation.

Yes, that is correct about communications. You don't need to contact anyone as long as you remain outside your class c airspace. We all learned that in training. You need to establish 2 way communications prior to entering class c airspace. I think you mentioned that your airport is under the outer class c shelf for Omaha. 

Another great thing about having BOTH ADS-B IN & OUT is that you can "see" all that traffic on your screen whether or not THEY are equipped with ADS-B. If you have both IN & OUT you will see ALL aircraft with a working transponder. Just another reason to have BOTH in and out.

Again, good luck with Josh and the factory. Please dont hold your breath during this process. :D

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